Talk:HSC50 Hierarchical Storage Controller - Revision history

Jnc: /* HSC50 Naming */ "Intelligent" is DEC's own term

2022-08-26T05:13:22Z

HSC50 Naming: "Intelligent" is DEC's own term

← Older revision		Revision as of 05:13, 26 August 2022
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	::: You must have a strange definition of "important"! :-) I think I would rather, as the expression in English goes, 'drill a hole in my skull - with a ''dull'' drill'!		::: You must have a strange definition of "important"! :-) I think I would rather, as the expression in English goes, 'drill a hole in my skull - with a ''dull'' drill'!
	::: I'm on travel this week, and do not have access to my copy of the DEC Acronyms Book. Not that it really matters, I think; I am sure that i) it won't give the formal name of the HSC50, or ii) ~~that~~ the usual expansion of 'HSC' was 'Hierarchical Storage Controller'. [[User:Jnc\|Jnc]] ([[User talk:Jnc\|talk]]) 17:01, 24 August 2022 (CEST)		::: I'm on travel this week, and do not have access to my copy of the DEC Acronyms Book. Not that it really matters, I think; I am sure that i) it won't give the formal name of the HSC50, or ii) the usual expansion of 'HSC' was 'Hierarchical Storage Controller'. [[User:Jnc\|Jnc]] ([[User talk:Jnc\|talk]]) 17:01, 24 August 2022 (CEST)

	:: Fourth name of HSC models is "Intelligent I/O Server" (according to "Systems and Options Catalog 1991 July-September").		:: Fourth name of HSC models is "Intelligent I/O Server" (according to "Systems and Options Catalog 1991 July-September").
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	:: More than ten years of success (HSC50:1983 - HSC65/HSC95:1993) are a good proof of an intelligent concept and realization for me.		:: More than ten years of success (HSC50:1983 - HSC65/HSC95:1993) are a good proof of an intelligent concept and realization for me.
	:: Maybe DEC's formal name for the HSC models was just "HSC", and all other names marketing strategy decisions? [[User:Vaxorcist\|Vaxorcist]] ([[User talk:Vaxorcist\|talk]]) 11:29, 25 August 2022 (CEST)		:: Maybe DEC's formal name for the HSC models was just "HSC", and all other names marketing strategy decisions? [[User:Vaxorcist\|Vaxorcist]] ([[User talk:Vaxorcist\|talk]]) 11:29, 25 August 2022 (CEST)

			::: "Intelligent" is DEC's own descriptive term for HSC units, e.g. "defined as an intelligent mass storage subsystem server" (from the [http://www.bitsavers.org/pdf/dec/dsa/hsc/EK-HSC50-UG-002_HSC50_Users_Guide_Aug84.pdf HSC50 User Guide], pg. 1-1).
			::: I know you are a big fan of the VAX line, but I would describe them as merely 'competent'; they had nothing like the lasting impact of contemporaries like the [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IBM_801 IBM 801]. [[User:Jnc\|Jnc]] ([[User talk:Jnc\|talk]]) 07:13, 26 August 2022 (CEST)

Vaxorcist: /* HSC50 Naming */ Typo fixed

2022-08-25T19:04:25Z

HSC50 Naming: Typo fixed

← Older revision		Revision as of 19:04, 25 August 2022
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	:: Fourth name of HSC models is "Intelligent I/O Server" (according to "Systems and Options Catalog 1991 July-September").		:: Fourth name of HSC models is "Intelligent I/O Server" (according to "Systems and Options Catalog 1991 July-September").
	:: I doubt the controller itself is really "intelligent", but its creators.		:: I doubt the controller itself is really "intelligent", but its creators.
	:: More than ten years of success (HSC50:1983 - HSC65/~~HSC90~~:1993) are a good proof of an intelligent concept and realization for me.		:: More than ten years of success (HSC50:1983 - HSC65/HSC95:1993) are a good proof of an intelligent concept and realization for me.
	:: Maybe DEC's formal name for the HSC models was just "HSC", and all other names marketing strategy decisions? [[User:Vaxorcist\|Vaxorcist]] ([[User talk:Vaxorcist\|talk]]) 11:29, 25 August 2022 (CEST)		:: Maybe DEC's formal name for the HSC models was just "HSC", and all other names marketing strategy decisions? [[User:Vaxorcist\|Vaxorcist]] ([[User talk:Vaxorcist\|talk]]) 11:29, 25 August 2022 (CEST)

Vaxorcist: /* HSC50 Naming */

2022-08-25T09:29:11Z

HSC50 Naming

← Older revision		Revision as of 09:29, 25 August 2022
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	::: You must have a strange definition of "important"! :-) I think I would rather, as the expression in English goes, 'drill a hole in my skull - with a ''dull'' drill'!		::: You must have a strange definition of "important"! :-) I think I would rather, as the expression in English goes, 'drill a hole in my skull - with a ''dull'' drill'!
	::: I'm on travel this week, and do not have access to my copy of the DEC Acronyms Book. Not that it really matters, I think; I am sure that i) it won't give the formal name of the HSC50, or ii) that the usual expansion of 'HSC' was 'Hierarchical Storage Controller'. [[User:Jnc\|Jnc]] ([[User talk:Jnc\|talk]]) 17:01, 24 August 2022 (CEST)		::: I'm on travel this week, and do not have access to my copy of the DEC Acronyms Book. Not that it really matters, I think; I am sure that i) it won't give the formal name of the HSC50, or ii) that the usual expansion of 'HSC' was 'Hierarchical Storage Controller'. [[User:Jnc\|Jnc]] ([[User talk:Jnc\|talk]]) 17:01, 24 August 2022 (CEST)

			:: Fourth name of HSC models is "Intelligent I/O Server" (according to "Systems and Options Catalog 1991 July-September").
			:: I doubt the controller itself is really "intelligent", but its creators.
			:: More than ten years of success (HSC50:1983 - HSC65/HSC90:1993) are a good proof of an intelligent concept and realization for me.
			:: Maybe DEC's formal name for the HSC models was just "HSC", and all other names marketing strategy decisions? [[User:Vaxorcist\|Vaxorcist]] ([[User talk:Vaxorcist\|talk]]) 11:29, 25 August 2022 (CEST)

Jnc: Jnc moved page Talk:HSC50 Mass-Storage Controller to Talk:HSC50 Hierarchical Storage Controller without leaving a redirect

2022-08-24T15:13:30Z

Jnc moved page Talk:HSC50 Mass-Storage Controller to Talk:HSC50 Hierarchical Storage Controller without leaving a redirect

← Older revision		Revision as of 15:13, 24 August 2022
(No difference)

Jnc: /* HSC50 Naming */ DEC's naming was more confused than usual!

2022-08-24T15:01:45Z

HSC50 Naming: DEC's naming was more confused than usual!

← Older revision		Revision as of 15:01, 24 August 2022
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	: Oh, I don't doubt that 'HSC' (on its own) was normally expanded to 'Hierarchical Storage Controller' by DEC - but that is a subtly different question from 'what was DEC's formal name for the HSC50'. It is certainly illogical that they called the HSC50 anything ''other'' than 'Hierarchical Storage Controller' - but there are two HSC50 documents that do just that! (And the fact that those names are capitalized there argues that they are - or are intended to be - formal names, and not just descriptive phrases which are appended to "HSC50" to indicate what an HSC50 ''was''.)		: Oh, I don't doubt that 'HSC' (on its own) was normally expanded to 'Hierarchical Storage Controller' by DEC - but that is a subtly different question from 'what was DEC's formal name for the HSC50'. It is certainly illogical that they called the HSC50 anything ''other'' than 'Hierarchical Storage Controller' - but there are two HSC50 documents that do just that! (And the fact that those names are capitalized there argues that they are - or are intended to be - formal names, and not just descriptive phrases which are appended to "HSC50" to indicate what an HSC50 ''was''.)
	: Of course, one could well conclude from that variability that DEC did not ''have'' a formal name for the HSC50 - other than "HSC50". Anyway, let me go look at those manuals you found. [[User:Jnc\|Jnc]] ([[User talk:Jnc\|talk]]) 16:34, 23 August 2022 (CEST)		: Of course, one could well conclude from that variability that DEC did not ''have'' a formal name for the HSC50 - other than "HSC50". Anyway, let me go look at those manuals you found. [[User:Jnc\|Jnc]] ([[User talk:Jnc\|talk]]) 16:34, 23 August 2022 (CEST)

			::: I couldn't find EK-HSCMN-IN-001 or AA-GMEAA-TK online. If you have a paper copy of either one, you should scan it, and make it available.
			::: None of the others provided any insight into what DEC's formal name for the HSC50 was.
			::: So, taking into account the confusion inside the DEC manuals that ''do'' give a formal name for it (above), it might just as well be at [[HSC50 Hierarchical Storage Controller]]. [[User:Jnc\|Jnc]] ([[User talk:Jnc\|talk]]) 17:01, 24 August 2022 (CEST)

	:: I would judge that the article in the Digital Technical Journal is of special importance. Furthermore I would like to draw the attention to the difference between what "something is" and what "something is named".		:: I would judge that the article in the Digital Technical Journal is of special importance. Furthermore I would like to draw the attention to the difference between what "something is" and what "something is named".
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	:: Another thought: What does the "DEC Acronyms Book" say in this matter? [[User:Vaxorcist\|Vaxorcist]] ([[User talk:Vaxorcist\|talk]]) 16:55, 23 August 2022 (CEST)		:: Another thought: What does the "DEC Acronyms Book" say in this matter? [[User:Vaxorcist\|Vaxorcist]] ([[User talk:Vaxorcist\|talk]]) 16:55, 23 August 2022 (CEST)

			::: You must have a strange definition of "important"! :-) I think I would rather, as the expression in English goes, 'drill a hole in my skull - with a ''dull'' drill'!
			::: I'm on travel this week, and do not have access to my copy of the DEC Acronyms Book. Not that it really matters, I think; I am sure that i) it won't give the formal name of the HSC50, or ii) that the usual expansion of 'HSC' was 'Hierarchical Storage Controller'. [[User:Jnc\|Jnc]] ([[User talk:Jnc\|talk]]) 17:01, 24 August 2022 (CEST)

Vaxorcist: /* HSC50 Naming */

2022-08-23T14:55:28Z

HSC50 Naming

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	:: By the way - I like the way we're debating such things as if they were really important! [[User:Vaxorcist\|Vaxorcist]] ([[User talk:Vaxorcist\|talk]]) 16:42, 23 August 2022 (CEST)		:: By the way - I like the way we're debating such things as if they were really important! [[User:Vaxorcist\|Vaxorcist]] ([[User talk:Vaxorcist\|talk]]) 16:42, 23 August 2022 (CEST)

			:: Another thought: What does the "DEC Acronyms Book" say in this matter? [[User:Vaxorcist\|Vaxorcist]] ([[User talk:Vaxorcist\|talk]]) 16:55, 23 August 2022 (CEST)

Vaxorcist: /* HSC50 Naming */

2022-08-23T14:42:50Z

HSC50 Naming

← Older revision		Revision as of 14:42, 23 August 2022
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	: Oh, I don't doubt that 'HSC' (on its own) was normally expanded to 'Hierarchical Storage Controller' by DEC - but that is a subtly different question from 'what was DEC's formal name for the HSC50'. It is certainly illogical that they called the HSC50 anything ''other'' than 'Hierarchical Storage Controller' - but there are two HSC50 documents that do just that! (And the fact that those names are capitalized there argues that they are - or are intended to be - formal names, and not just descriptive phrases which are appended to "HSC50" to indicate what an HSC50 ''was''.)		: Oh, I don't doubt that 'HSC' (on its own) was normally expanded to 'Hierarchical Storage Controller' by DEC - but that is a subtly different question from 'what was DEC's formal name for the HSC50'. It is certainly illogical that they called the HSC50 anything ''other'' than 'Hierarchical Storage Controller' - but there are two HSC50 documents that do just that! (And the fact that those names are capitalized there argues that they are - or are intended to be - formal names, and not just descriptive phrases which are appended to "HSC50" to indicate what an HSC50 ''was''.)
	: Of course, one could well conclude from that variability that DEC did not ''have'' a formal name for the HSC50 - other than "HSC50". Anyway, let me go look at those manuals you found. [[User:Jnc\|Jnc]] ([[User talk:Jnc\|talk]]) 16:34, 23 August 2022 (CEST)		: Of course, one could well conclude from that variability that DEC did not ''have'' a formal name for the HSC50 - other than "HSC50". Anyway, let me go look at those manuals you found. [[User:Jnc\|Jnc]] ([[User talk:Jnc\|talk]]) 16:34, 23 August 2022 (CEST)

			:: I would judge that the article in the Digital Technical Journal is of special importance. Furthermore I would like to draw the attention to the difference between what "something is" and what "something is named".

			:: By the way - I like the way we're debating such things as if they were really important! [[User:Vaxorcist\|Vaxorcist]] ([[User talk:Vaxorcist\|talk]]) 16:42, 23 August 2022 (CEST)

Jnc: /* HSC50 Naming */ So confusing

2022-08-23T14:34:36Z

HSC50 Naming: So confusing

← Older revision		Revision as of 14:34, 23 August 2022
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	::* Software Product Description Compaq OpenVMS Operating7.2-1H1, and 7.2-2. System for Alpha and VAX, Versions 7.2, 7.2-1, SPD 41.87.08, pages 43, 44 [[User:Vaxorcist\|Vaxorcist]] ([[User talk:Vaxorcist\|talk]]) 16:10, 23 August 2022 (CEST)		::* Software Product Description Compaq OpenVMS Operating7.2-1H1, and 7.2-2. System for Alpha and VAX, Versions 7.2, 7.2-1, SPD 41.87.08, pages 43, 44 [[User:Vaxorcist\|Vaxorcist]] ([[User talk:Vaxorcist\|talk]]) 16:10, 23 August 2022 (CEST)

			: Oh, I don't doubt that 'HSC' (on its own) was normally expanded to 'Hierarchical Storage Controller' by DEC - but that is a subtly different question from 'what was DEC's formal name for the HSC50'. It is certainly illogical that they called the HSC50 anything ''other'' than 'Hierarchical Storage Controller' - but there are two HSC50 documents that do just that! (And the fact that those names are capitalized there argues that they are - or are intended to be - formal names, and not just descriptive phrases which are appended to "HSC50" to indicate what an HSC50 ''was''.)
			: Of course, one could well conclude from that variability that DEC did not ''have'' a formal name for the HSC50 - other than "HSC50". Anyway, let me go look at those manuals you found. [[User:Jnc\|Jnc]] ([[User talk:Jnc\|talk]]) 16:34, 23 August 2022 (CEST)

Vaxorcist at 14:10, 23 August 2022

2022-08-23T14:10:47Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 14:10, 23 August 2022
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	: I personally do not care at all whether the page is named 'HSC50 Mass-Storage Controller' or 'HSC50 Hierarchical Storage Controller'; either would be fine with me. As usual, I care less what is ''logical'', than what is ''historically accurate'' - what DEC itself actually called the thing ''at the time''.		: I personally do not care at all whether the page is named 'HSC50 Mass-Storage Controller' or 'HSC50 Hierarchical Storage Controller'; either would be fine with me. As usual, I care less what is ''logical'', than what is ''historically accurate'' - what DEC itself actually called the thing ''at the time''.
	: And, as usual, contradictory evidence of what that was leaves us in the dark! [[User:Jnc\|Jnc]] ([[User talk:Jnc\|talk]]) 13:22, 23 August 2022 (CEST)		: And, as usual, contradictory evidence of what that was leaves us in the dark! [[User:Jnc\|Jnc]] ([[User talk:Jnc\|talk]]) 13:22, 23 August 2022 (CEST)

			:: I found seven occurrances of "Hierarchical Storage Controller", and for the sake of the Acronym "HSC", I would like that.

			::* EK-HSCMA-SV-001 HSC Service Manual, page 21 (2*)
			::* EK-HSCMA-SV-002 HSC Service Manual, page 21
			::* EK-HSCMN-IN-001 HSC Installation Manual, page 9
			::* EK-HSCMN-IN-002 HSC Installation Manual, pages 13, 17, 18
			::* R. Lary and R. Bean, "The Hierarchical Storage Controller, A Tightly Coupled Multiprocessor as Storage Server," Digital Technical Journal, vol. 1, no. 8 (February 1989): 8-24.
			::* AA-GMEAA-TK HSC User Guide HSC50 V2.50 HSC70 V1.00-O, page 341:

			::HSC - Hierarchical Storage Controller
			::An intelligent mass storage server used on the Computer Interconnect (CI) bus.
			::capable of supporting a total of eight and/or tape data channels, the HSC is part of the System Interconnect Architecture and DIGITAL Storage Architecture
			::By performing as an I/O manager, the HSC can be classified as an I/O server, removing the burden of I/O management from the CPU.

			::* Software Product Description Compaq OpenVMS Operating7.2-1H1, and 7.2-2. System for Alpha and VAX, Versions 7.2, 7.2-1, SPD 41.87.08, pages 43, 44 [[User:Vaxorcist\|Vaxorcist]] ([[User talk:Vaxorcist\|talk]]) 16:10, 23 August 2022 (CEST)

Jnc: /* HSC50 Naming */ More DEC confusion!!

2022-08-23T11:22:26Z

HSC50 Naming: More DEC confusion!!

← Older revision		Revision as of 11:22, 23 August 2022
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	I would propose renaming the HSC50 page to "HSC50 Hierarchical Storage Controller". [[User:Vaxorcist\|Vaxorcist]] ([[User talk:Vaxorcist\|talk]]) 11:29, 23 August 2022 (CEST)		I would propose renaming the HSC50 page to "HSC50 Hierarchical Storage Controller". [[User:Vaxorcist\|Vaxorcist]] ([[User talk:Vaxorcist\|talk]]) 11:29, 23 August 2022 (CEST)

			: I got the "HSC50 Mass-Storage Controller' from the [http://www.bitsavers.org/pdf/dec/dsa/hsc/AA-P672A-TK_HSC50_Maintenance_Guide_1984.pdf HSC50 Maintenance Guide] (pg. 1). However, I see that the [http://www.bitsavers.org/pdf/dec/dsa/hsc/EK-HSC50-UG-002_HSC50_Users_Guide_Aug84.pdf HSC50 User Guide] calls it the "HSC50 Mass Storage Server" (Preface, pg. v). So, several DEC documents about the HSC50 disagree about the 'Controller'/'Server', but do agree on the 'Mass Storage'!
			: To add to the confusion, 'Controller' would seem to be preferred from the name, "HS'''C'''" - but if we are to rely on ''that'' as a guide, then we should go with 'Hierarchical'!!
			: Do you know of any DEC documents that give the formal name of the HSC50 to be 'HSC50 Hierarchical Storage Controller'?
			: I personally do not care at all whether the page is named 'HSC50 Mass-Storage Controller' or 'HSC50 Hierarchical Storage Controller'; either would be fine with me. As usual, I care less what is ''logical'', than what is ''historically accurate'' - what DEC itself actually called the thing ''at the time''.
			: And, as usual, contradictory evidence of what that was leaves us in the dark! [[User:Jnc\|Jnc]] ([[User talk:Jnc\|talk]]) 13:22, 23 August 2022 (CEST)