Talk:IMP interface - Revision history

Jnc: /* Nova interface */ typo

2025-01-07T03:02:09Z

‎Nova interface: typo

Jnc: /* Nova interface */ new section

2025-01-06T19:57:04Z

‎Nova interface: new section

Jnc: /* DR11C */ Link Stanford 1822 Interface

2024-11-13T17:31:04Z

‎DR11C: Link Stanford 1822 Interface

Jnc: /* DR11C */ I think the SRI interface was originally designed for use with the DR11-C

2024-11-13T17:14:50Z

‎DR11C: I think the SRI interface was originally designed for use with the DR11-C

Jnc: Thoughts on splitting, an Alto 1822 interface page

2021-11-13T14:30:02Z

Thoughts on splitting, an Alto 1822 interface page

Jnc: /* Duplicative? */ One page _could_ work, I suppose

2021-11-08T19:04:04Z

‎Duplicative?: One page _could_ work, I suppose

Larsbrinkhoff: /* Duplicative? */ Yes.

2021-11-08T16:38:03Z

‎Duplicative?: Yes.

Jnc: /* Duplicative? */ typo

2021-11-08T15:39:05Z

‎Duplicative?: typo

Jnc: /* Dulicative? */ new section

2021-11-08T15:38:26Z

‎Dulicative?: new section

Jnc: /* More interfaces */ But it was in a 10-1/2" mounting box

2021-11-04T17:30:40Z

‎More interfaces: But it was in a 10-1/2" mounting box

← Older revision		Revision as of 03:02, 7 January 2025
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	== Nova interface ==		== Nova interface ==

−	There was some lack of certainty over whether [[Maxc]]1's 1822 interface was attached to the [[Nova]] front end, or not. (It seemed likely, but I knew of no ''evidence''.) Fiala]'s [https://github.com/PDP-10/maxc/blob/master/pdf/the_maxc_systems.pdf Maxc paper] seems to indicate that it was indeed attached to the Nova - but that paper does not provide a great amount of detail on the I/O system. (Due to the use of a Nova on Maxc1 and an [[Alto]] on Maxc2, the ''hardware'' of the two must be somewhat different between the two. Since the basic Alto microcode emulates a Nova, the software on the two ''may'' be fairly similar, though.) I don't know if the TENEX source for Maxc has been retained; if it has, it should be possible to examine it and say for certain if Maxc1's 1822 interface was attached to the front end. [[User:Jnc\|Jnc]] ([[User talk:Jnc\|talk]]) 20:57, 6 January 2025 (CET)	+	There was some lack of certainty over whether [[Maxc]]1's 1822 interface was attached to the [[Nova]] front end, or not. (It seemed likely, but I knew of no ''evidence''.) Fiala's [https://github.com/PDP-10/maxc/blob/master/pdf/the_maxc_systems.pdf Maxc paper] seems to indicate that it was indeed attached to the Nova - but that paper does not provide a great amount of detail on the I/O system. (Due to the use of a Nova on Maxc1 and an [[Alto]] on Maxc2, the ''hardware'' of the two must be somewhat different between the two. Since the basic Alto microcode emulates a Nova, the software on the two ''may'' be fairly similar, though.) I don't know if the TENEX source for Maxc has been retained; if it has, it should be possible to examine it and say for certain if Maxc1's 1822 interface was attached to the front end. [[User:Jnc\|Jnc]] ([[User talk:Jnc\|talk]]) 20:57, 6 January 2025 (CET)

← Older revision		Revision as of 19:57, 6 January 2025
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	There's enough info on the Alto 1822 interface in the [https://xeroxalto.computerhistory.org/Indigo/Alto-1822/.index.html Alto 1822 archive] to do a good page on it, which I will do. [[User:Jnc\|Jnc]] ([[User talk:Jnc\|talk]]) 15:29, 13 November 2021 (CET)		There's enough info on the Alto 1822 interface in the [https://xeroxalto.computerhistory.org/Indigo/Alto-1822/.index.html Alto 1822 archive] to do a good page on it, which I will do. [[User:Jnc\|Jnc]] ([[User talk:Jnc\|talk]]) 15:29, 13 November 2021 (CET)
		+
		+	== Nova interface ==
		+
		+	There was some lack of certainty over whether [[Maxc]]1's 1822 interface was attached to the [[Nova]] front end, or not. (It seemed likely, but I knew of no ''evidence''.) Fiala]'s [https://github.com/PDP-10/maxc/blob/master/pdf/the_maxc_systems.pdf Maxc paper] seems to indicate that it was indeed attached to the Nova - but that paper does not provide a great amount of detail on the I/O system. (Due to the use of a Nova on Maxc1 and an [[Alto]] on Maxc2, the ''hardware'' of the two must be somewhat different between the two. Since the basic Alto microcode emulates a Nova, the software on the two ''may'' be fairly similar, though.) I don't know if the TENEX source for Maxc has been retained; if it has, it should be possible to examine it and say for certain if Maxc1's 1822 interface was attached to the front end. [[User:Jnc\|Jnc]] ([[User talk:Jnc\|talk]]) 20:57, 6 January 2025 (CET)

@@ Line 10: / Line 10: @@
 : Anyway, for the ''SRI'' thing, it was possibly both, actually. What it was was an SRI board that took the bit-stream from the IMP, doing the host-IMP hardware protocol ('there's your bit', etc), and converted it to words, which it shipped over a parallel interface to a standard DEC [[DRV11]] card. I'm pretty sure the QBUS DRV11 and UNIBUS [[DR11-C]] had the same parallel port spec, so you could probably have plugged the SRI card into a DR11-C instead of a DRV11. Since the DR11-C/DRV11 are programmed I/O, they wouldn't have had the performance of the others, which were DMA, which is probably why UNIBUS machines tended to go with the DEC/ACC interfaces. [[User:Jnc|Jnc]] ([[User talk:Jnc|talk]]) 15:55, 15 March 2018 (CET)
-::: I have a vague memory that the early SRI interface manual talks about the DR11-C; i.e. that interface was originally designed for use with the DR11-C. The DRV11 was just a later plug-compatible substitution. [[User:Jnc|Jnc]] ([[User talk:Jnc|talk]]) 18:14, 13 November 2024 (CET)
+::: I have a vague memory that the early [[Stanford 1822 Interface]] manual talks about the DR11-C; i.e. that interface was perhaps originally designed for use with the DR11-C. The DRV11 may have been just a later plug-compatible substitution. [[User:Jnc|Jnc]] ([[User talk:Jnc|talk]]) 18:14, 13 November 2024 (CET)
 :: Sorry, wrong link.  This is better:

@@ Line 8: / Line 8: @@
 : Huh? That page talks about the IMP11-A, the DEC CSS thing.
-: Anyway, for the ''SRI'' thing, it was possibly both, actually. What it was was an SRI board that took the bit-stream from the IMP, doing the host-IMP harware protocol ('there's your bit', etc), and converted it to words, which it shipped over a parallel interface to a standard DEC DRV11 card. I'm pretty sure the QBUS DRV11 and UNIBUS DRV11-C had the same parallel port spec, so you could probably have plugged the SRI card into a DR11-C instead of a DRV11. Since the DR11-C/DRV11 are programmed I/O, they wouldn't have had the performance of the others, which were DMA, which is probably why UNIBUS machines tended to go with the DEC/ACC interfaces. [[User:Jnc|Jnc]] ([[User talk:Jnc|talk]]) 15:55, 15 March 2018 (CET)
+: Anyway, for the ''SRI'' thing, it was possibly both, actually. What it was was an SRI board that took the bit-stream from the IMP, doing the host-IMP hardware protocol ('there's your bit', etc), and converted it to words, which it shipped over a parallel interface to a standard DEC [[DRV11]] card. I'm pretty sure the QBUS DRV11 and UNIBUS [[DR11-C]] had the same parallel port spec, so you could probably have plugged the SRI card into a DR11-C instead of a DRV11. Since the DR11-C/DRV11 are programmed I/O, they wouldn't have had the performance of the others, which were DMA, which is probably why UNIBUS machines tended to go with the DEC/ACC interfaces. [[User:Jnc|Jnc]] ([[User talk:Jnc|talk]]) 15:55, 15 March 2018 (CET)
 :: Sorry, wrong link.  This is better:

@@ Line 81: / Line 81: @@
 ::: Interesting; the LH-DH/11 manual clearly indicates it's in a 10-1/2" box - which I don't remember one on either the AI or MC KS's. Unless there was a later version on a single board, which could mount in the BA11 mounting box. I'll have to ask Alan (and maybe JTW remembers too). [[User:Jnc|Jnc]] ([[User talk:Jnc|talk]]) 18:30, 4 November 2021 (CET)
-== Duplicative? ==
+==Duplicative?==
 I guess this is kind of duplicative, now that [[1822 interface‎]] exists. Maybe not, though; that page is focused on the 1822 interface spec ''itself'' (for use in places like [[Packet Radio Network]]), whereas ''this'' page is more about the various host/bus interfaces that produce 1822 interface capability. I guess this distinction/separation isn't as clear as it could/should be, currently; I'm busy at the moment, but I'll look at these in the next day or so. [[User:Jnc|Jnc]] ([[User talk:Jnc|talk]]) 16:38, 8 November 2021 (CET)
@@ Line 87: / Line 87: @@
 : I also noted this, but was thinking "IMP interface" is more a view from the host side.  Now that I read the page contents  here, I think it could just as well be a section on the 1822 interface page.  [[User:Larsbrinkhoff|Larsbrinkhoff]] ([[User talk:Larsbrinkhoff|talk]]) 17:37, 8 November 2021 (CET)
-: I suppose there wouldn't be any loss of generality in covering the 1822 interface spec ''and'' the host interfaces that support it on one page. I have to go ponder all this, though. [[User:Jnc|Jnc]] ([[User talk:Jnc|talk]]) 20:03, 8 November 2021 (CET)
+:: I suppose there wouldn't be any loss of generality in covering the 1822 interface spec ''and'' the host interfaces that support it on one page. I have to go ponder all this, though. [[User:Jnc|Jnc]] ([[User talk:Jnc|talk]]) 20:03, 8 November 2021 (CET)

← Older revision		Revision as of 19:04, 8 November 2021
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	: I also noted this, but was thinking "IMP interface" is more a view from the host side. Now that I read the page contents here, I think it could just as well be a section on the 1822 interface page. [[User:Larsbrinkhoff\|Larsbrinkhoff]] ([[User talk:Larsbrinkhoff\|talk]]) 17:37, 8 November 2021 (CET)		: I also noted this, but was thinking "IMP interface" is more a view from the host side. Now that I read the page contents here, I think it could just as well be a section on the 1822 interface page. [[User:Larsbrinkhoff\|Larsbrinkhoff]] ([[User talk:Larsbrinkhoff\|talk]]) 17:37, 8 November 2021 (CET)
		+
		+	: I suppose there wouldn't be any loss of generality in covering the 1822 interface spec ''and'' the host interfaces that support it on one page. I have to go ponder all this, though. [[User:Jnc\|Jnc]] ([[User talk:Jnc\|talk]]) 20:03, 8 November 2021 (CET)

← Older revision		Revision as of 16:38, 8 November 2021
Line 84:		Line 84:

	I guess this is kind of duplicative, now that [[1822 interface‎]] exists. Maybe not, though; that page is focused on the 1822 interface spec ''itself'' (for use in places like [[Packet Radio Network]]), whereas ''this'' page is more about the various host/bus interfaces that produce 1822 interface capability. I guess this distinction/separation isn't as clear as it could/should be, currently; I'm busy at the moment, but I'll look at these in the next day or so. [[User:Jnc\|Jnc]] ([[User talk:Jnc\|talk]]) 16:38, 8 November 2021 (CET)		I guess this is kind of duplicative, now that [[1822 interface‎]] exists. Maybe not, though; that page is focused on the 1822 interface spec ''itself'' (for use in places like [[Packet Radio Network]]), whereas ''this'' page is more about the various host/bus interfaces that produce 1822 interface capability. I guess this distinction/separation isn't as clear as it could/should be, currently; I'm busy at the moment, but I'll look at these in the next day or so. [[User:Jnc\|Jnc]] ([[User talk:Jnc\|talk]]) 16:38, 8 November 2021 (CET)
		+
		+	: I also noted this, but was thinking "IMP interface" is more a view from the host side. Now that I read the page contents here, I think it could just as well be a section on the 1822 interface page. [[User:Larsbrinkhoff\|Larsbrinkhoff]] ([[User talk:Larsbrinkhoff\|talk]]) 17:37, 8 November 2021 (CET)

← Older revision		Revision as of 15:38, 8 November 2021
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	::: Interesting; the LH-DH/11 manual clearly indicates it's in a 10-1/2" box - which I don't remember one on either the AI or MC KS's. Unless there was a later version on a single board, which could mount in the BA11 mounting box. I'll have to ask Alan (and maybe JTW remembers too). [[User:Jnc\|Jnc]] ([[User talk:Jnc\|talk]]) 18:30, 4 November 2021 (CET)		::: Interesting; the LH-DH/11 manual clearly indicates it's in a 10-1/2" box - which I don't remember one on either the AI or MC KS's. Unless there was a later version on a single board, which could mount in the BA11 mounting box. I'll have to ask Alan (and maybe JTW remembers too). [[User:Jnc\|Jnc]] ([[User talk:Jnc\|talk]]) 18:30, 4 November 2021 (CET)
		+
		+	== Dulicative? ==
		+
		+	I guess this is kind of duplicative, now that [[1822 interface‎]] exists. Maybe not, though; that page is focused on the 1822 interface spec ''itself'' (for use in places like [[Packet Radio Network]]), whereas ''this'' page is more about the various host/bus interfaces that produce 1822 interface capability. I guess this distinction/separation isn't as clear as it could/should be, currently; I'm busy at the moment, but I'll look at these in the next day or so. [[User:Jnc\|Jnc]] ([[User talk:Jnc\|talk]]) 16:38, 8 November 2021 (CET)

@@ Line 75: / Line 75: @@
 ::: Probably not. The LH-DH/11 has a bit in the transmit CSR which isn't there in the MLH-DH/LSI11 - "WC0". The MOS 1822 DMA driver defines all the bits - except that one. Also, a lot of the bit ''names'' changed between the LH-DH/11 and the MLH-DH/LSI11 (even though they do the sae things!) - and the MOS 1822 DMA driver uses the new names. [[User:Jnc|Jnc]] ([[User talk:Jnc|talk]]) 23:51, 30 October 2021 (CEST)
-::: So I looked at that [[https://github.com/larsbrinkhoff/simh/issues/11 ANTS/ISI interface stuff]]; it's pretty clearly neither a [[IMP11-A ARPANET interface|IMP11-A]], nor an [[LH-DH/11 Local/Distant Host Controller|LH-DH/11]] or clone. [[User:Jnc|Jnc]] ([[User talk:Jnc|talk]]) 16:11, 4 November 2021 (CET)
+::: So I looked at that [[https://github.com/larsbrinkhoff/simh/issues/11 ANTS/ISI interface stuff]]; it's pretty clearly neither an [[IMP11-A ARPANET interface|IMP11-A]], nor an [[LH-DH/11 Local/Distant Host Controller|LH-DH/11]] clone. [[User:Jnc|Jnc]] ([[User talk:Jnc|talk]]) 16:11, 4 November 2021 (CET)
-:::: Thanks!  As for KS10 ITS, I meant the ACC LH-DH Unibus card.  That's how ITS and KLH10 refer to it, anyway.
+::: Interesting; the LH-DH/11 manual clearly indicates it's in a 10-1/2" box - which I don't remember one on either the AI or MC KS's. Unless there was a later version on a single board, which could mount in the BA11 mounting box. I'll have to ask Alan (and maybe JTW remembers too). [[User:Jnc|Jnc]] ([[User talk:Jnc|talk]]) 18:30, 4 November 2021 (CET)