Talk:Incompatible Timesharing System - Revision history

Larsbrinkhoff: /* First network file system */ new section

2024-12-09T18:38:05Z

First network file system: new section

← Older revision		Revision as of 18:38, 9 December 2024
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	I think we've got enough ITS-related articles to make it worthwhile to have a [[:Category:ITS]]. (I thought maybe it should be [[:Category:Incompatible Timesharing System]], but that's pretty long and clunky. Still, might be the right thing.) What does everyone think? [[User:Jnc\|Jnc]] ([[User talk:Jnc\|talk]]) 15:20, 12 January 2024 (CET)		I think we've got enough ITS-related articles to make it worthwhile to have a [[:Category:ITS]]. (I thought maybe it should be [[:Category:Incompatible Timesharing System]], but that's pretty long and clunky. Still, might be the right thing.) What does everyone think? [[User:Jnc\|Jnc]] ([[User talk:Jnc\|talk]]) 15:20, 12 January 2024 (CET)

			== First network file system ==

			The article says "''This may have been the first example of a 'network file system' in any OS.''" The evidence from backup tapes points to ITS having this network file system in late 1972. However, when browsing early RFCs, I found the '''Simple-Minded File System''', or SMFS. This appears to be a network file system, and the first RFC 122 is from April 1971. Clearly that one describes the plan for a future system, but RFC 217 from September the same year does seem to say the service is available. So this would have ITS beat by a year or so. [[User:Larsbrinkhoff\|Larsbrinkhoff]] ([[User talk:Larsbrinkhoff\|talk]]) 19:38, 9 December 2024 (CET)

Jnc: Move dest

2024-02-05T12:41:31Z

Move dest

← Older revision		Revision as of 12:41, 5 February 2024
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	''Many configuration-related entries have been moved to [[Talk:ITS ~~machines~~ configurations]].''		''Many configuration-related entries have been moved to [[Talk:ITS machine configurations]].''

	==Timeline==		==Timeline==

Jnc: Note where moved entries went

2024-02-04T19:23:13Z

Note where moved entries went

← Older revision		Revision as of 19:23, 4 February 2024
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			''Many configuration-related entries have been moved to [[Talk:ITS machines configurations]].''

	==Timeline==		==Timeline==

Jnc: Move

2024-02-04T19:17:14Z

Move

Show changes

Larsbrinkhoff: /* AI PDP-6 */ Sounds good.

2024-02-04T18:27:15Z

AI PDP-6: Sounds good.

← Older revision		Revision as of 18:27, 4 February 2024
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	:: Should we have an [[ITS machines configurations]] page? (The name is just a quick first hack; suggestions for something better sincerely requested!) Looking at the recent 9th floor pictures from the CHM, we now have even better data (especially on MC)! It's too bad that collection doesn't include any of AI, though. [[User:Jnc\|Jnc]] ([[User talk:Jnc\|talk]]) 18:45, 4 February 2024 (CET)		:: Should we have an [[ITS machines configurations]] page? (The name is just a quick first hack; suggestions for something better sincerely requested!) Looking at the recent 9th floor pictures from the CHM, we now have even better data (especially on MC)! It's too bad that collection doesn't include any of AI, though. [[User:Jnc\|Jnc]] ([[User talk:Jnc\|talk]]) 18:45, 4 February 2024 (CET)

			::: Yes, that could be good to have. The CONFIG file is a good source too. I'm particular to the AI KA10 myself, which has lots of interesting hardware.
			::: AI is so photo shy! I have found photos and video from various places, but barely anything capturing AI. Just the odd corner here and there. [[User:Larsbrinkhoff\|Larsbrinkhoff]] ([[User talk:Larsbrinkhoff\|talk]]) 19:27, 4 February 2024 (CET)

	==Timeline==		==Timeline==

Jnc: Should we have an 'ITS machines configurations' page?

2024-02-04T17:46:15Z

Should we have an 'ITS machines configurations' page?

← Older revision		Revision as of 17:46, 4 February 2024
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	: Right. I have collected all information I have found on each of the classical ITS machines here: [https://github.com/PDP-10/its/issues/181], but I figured it was too much for this page. [[User:Larsbrinkhoff]] 18:14, 14 December 2017 (CET)		: Right. I have collected all information I have found on each of the classical ITS machines here: [https://github.com/PDP-10/its/issues/181], but I figured it was too much for this page. [[User:Larsbrinkhoff]] 18:14, 14 December 2017 (CET)

			:: Should we have an [[ITS machines configurations]] page? (The name is just a quick first hack; suggestions for something better sincerely requested!) Looking at the recent 9th floor pictures from the CHM, we now have even better data (especially on MC)! It's too bad that collection doesn't include any of AI, though. [[User:Jnc\|Jnc]] ([[User talk:Jnc\|talk]]) 18:45, 4 February 2024 (CET)

	==Timeline==		==Timeline==

Jnc: /* Add a Category:ITS? */ new section

2024-01-12T14:20:06Z

Add a Category:ITS?: new section

← Older revision		Revision as of 14:20, 12 January 2024
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	: Your rewording looks good to me.		: Your rewording looks good to me.
	: [[User:Larsbrinkhoff\|Larsbrinkhoff]] ([[User talk:Larsbrinkhoff\|talk]]) 15:09, 30 November 2023 (CET)		: [[User:Larsbrinkhoff\|Larsbrinkhoff]] ([[User talk:Larsbrinkhoff\|talk]]) 15:09, 30 November 2023 (CET)

			== Add a Category:ITS? ==

			I think we've got enough ITS-related articles to make it worthwhile to have a [[:Category:ITS]]. (I thought maybe it should be [[:Category:Incompatible Timesharing System]], but that's pretty long and clunky. Still, might be the right thing.) What does everyone think? [[User:Jnc\|Jnc]] ([[User talk:Jnc\|talk]]) 15:20, 12 January 2024 (CET)

Larsbrinkhoff: /* ITS before PDP-6? */ No ITS before PDP-6.

2023-11-30T14:09:41Z

ITS before PDP-6?: No ITS before PDP-6.

← Older revision		Revision as of 14:09, 30 November 2023
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	I've always found that ''if'' people can mis-read something, some will - which I seem to have done here! :-) (When I'm writing posts, I always look for ways in which they can be mis-read, and re-word the posts to try and eliminate them.) [[User:Jnc\|Jnc]] ([[User talk:Jnc\|talk]]) 14:28, 30 November 2023 (CET)		I've always found that ''if'' people can mis-read something, some will - which I seem to have done here! :-) (When I'm writing posts, I always look for ways in which they can be mis-read, and re-word the posts to try and eliminate them.) [[User:Jnc\|Jnc]] ([[User talk:Jnc\|talk]]) 14:28, 30 November 2023 (CET)

			: By "first version for PDP-6" I mean that later versions ran on PDP-10s, or more precisely KA10, KL10, and KS10 PDP-10 processors.
			: No, there was no ITS before the PDP-6. (But there was a thriving toolset running standalone.)
			: I thought it an interesting ITS "milestone" (maybe it's a negative mileage!) to note that apparently preparations where being made for timesharing a year ahead ITS went into operation. Maybe it's pre-history, or maybe events that led directly to X can be part of X history.
			: Your rewording looks good to me.
			: [[User:Larsbrinkhoff\|Larsbrinkhoff]] ([[User talk:Larsbrinkhoff\|talk]]) 15:09, 30 November 2023 (CET)

Jnc: /* ITS before PDP-6? */ new section

2023-11-30T13:28:12Z

ITS before PDP-6?: new section

← Older revision		Revision as of 13:28, 30 November 2023
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	:: Sure. If anyone wants to read the messages I linked to individually (above), they are all in [https://github.com/PDP-10/its-vault/blob/master/files/sysdoc/its.obugs1 this file]. Interestingly, in looking for them, I found a message from Alan Bawden (Date: 25 July 1984 16:56-EDT) which says "I moved the various notes and things that used to be taped to the inside front door of the first MF10 into the first MH10", which seems to indicate that the MF10's were physically ''replaced'' with MH10's, not merely ''upgraded into'' MH10's. [[User:Jnc\|Jnc]] ([[User talk:Jnc\|talk]]) 15:15, 4 November 2023 (CET)		:: Sure. If anyone wants to read the messages I linked to individually (above), they are all in [https://github.com/PDP-10/its-vault/blob/master/files/sysdoc/its.obugs1 this file]. Interestingly, in looking for them, I found a message from Alan Bawden (Date: 25 July 1984 16:56-EDT) which says "I moved the various notes and things that used to be taped to the inside front door of the first MF10 into the first MH10", which seems to indicate that the MF10's were physically ''replaced'' with MH10's, not merely ''upgraded into'' MH10's. [[User:Jnc\|Jnc]] ([[User talk:Jnc\|talk]]) 15:15, 4 November 2023 (CET)

			== ITS before PDP-6? ==

			So I don't understand this recent time-line entry:

			1967 - First version for PDP-6 — ITS 1.0 3/19/67

			Did ITS run on something ''else'' before the PDP-6? The [https://web.archive.org/web/20220824151311/http://web.mit.edu/6.933/www/Fall2001/AILab.pdf AI Lab History] doesn't mention anything? Perhaps the previous line:

			* 1966 - Moby memory acquired and TTY device added four more teletypes; preparing for timesharing?

			is not ''ITS'' history, but the history of the hardware on which ITS ''later'' ran; in other words, it is ITS ''pre-history''?

			If so, perhaps that entry would be better worded:

			1967 - First version of ITS; ran on PDP-6 — ITS 1.0 3/19/67

			I've always found that ''if'' people can mis-read something, some will - which I seem to have done here! :-) (When I'm writing posts, I always look for ways in which they can be mis-read, and re-word the posts to try and eliminate them.) [[User:Jnc\|Jnc]] ([[User talk:Jnc\|talk]]) 14:28, 30 November 2023 (CET)

Jnc: /* NoCrew BUG-ITS archive disappeared */ Sure; and an old mystery solved?

2023-11-04T14:15:17Z

NoCrew BUG-ITS archive disappeared: Sure; and an old mystery solved?

← Older revision		Revision as of 14:15, 4 November 2023
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	: Thanks for the heads up! I'll have to look into it. Many years ago, I made a script which picked individual messages apart for presenting them as an email arvchive, and the result is what you have linked into. However, it was still a work in progress, so maybe it's time to finish it off properly and put it in a more permanent location. [[User:Larsbrinkhoff\|Larsbrinkhoff]] ([[User talk:Larsbrinkhoff\|talk]]) 14:05, 4 November 2023 (CET)		: Thanks for the heads up! I'll have to look into it. Many years ago, I made a script which picked individual messages apart for presenting them as an email arvchive, and the result is what you have linked into. However, it was still a work in progress, so maybe it's time to finish it off properly and put it in a more permanent location. [[User:Larsbrinkhoff\|Larsbrinkhoff]] ([[User talk:Larsbrinkhoff\|talk]]) 14:05, 4 November 2023 (CET)

			:: Sure. If anyone wants to read the messages I linked to individually (above), they are all in [https://github.com/PDP-10/its-vault/blob/master/files/sysdoc/its.obugs1 this file]. Interestingly, in looking for them, I found a message from Alan Bawden (Date: 25 July 1984 16:56-EDT) which says "I moved the various notes and things that used to be taped to the inside front door of the first MF10 into the first MH10", which seems to indicate that the MF10's were physically ''replaced'' with MH10's, not merely ''upgraded into'' MH10's. [[User:Jnc\|Jnc]] ([[User talk:Jnc\|talk]]) 15:15, 4 November 2023 (CET)